Audio Interview, Hector Arguinzoni, April 20, 2012

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: There was no elaborate lighting.

It was just a dance floor.

EVELYN BAILEY: 45s?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: 45s and LPs.

EVELYN BAILEY: And, yeah, LPs.

But no variable speed?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: No mixing.

It was just a plain old standard--

in his case, it was just a plain old standard.

Now, when I started DJing at the Red Carpet, which was shortly

after that, what I was doing, as I was telling you that,

I was coming home with all these 45s.

And I was going home with my little tape deck

and making these mix tapes as close to what

I was hearing in the underground clubs in New York. (Laughs)

Because these boys were really building an industry.

And they really didn't know it at that time,

but they were developing their own equipment, their own mixers

and their own-- they were using Thoren turntables,

which nobody knew how they were controlling the speed.

But it was Thoren had made a turntable.

It had a little pitch control.

And I was always fascinated at how

they could do that, especially at the Hollywood.

Because the guy there, his name was Richard Kip.

He was unbelievable.

And he would just--

I was always fascinated how he could blend

one record into the other.

And the other one coming in and overlaid over the other one.

And it was because he had those pitch controls.

I was hanging over the booth, just checking and peering in.

But they-- when we started--

when I'd come back, we'd put these tapes together.

We'd go over to the Red Carpet.

That was owned by Jesse Vulo.

And Jesse and the Red Carpet was,

right now, where the Metro YMCA is right across from Eastman.

That's where the Red Carpet was.

And it was just a piano bar.

OK, it was just a piano bar, really a nice little piano bar.

And we'd take over the piano area, and throw the tapes on,

and we'd dance around the piano. (Laughter)

But Jesse saw an opportunity, and he owned the building

at the time.

So he blew out the wall, took over the next front,

and created a two story tall dance section.

And the DJ booth was like a fire escape on a second level.

And you had to climb up, which was very difficult with records

to climb up to that thing.

But he did that later on.

And he had--

I remember flying to--

on a private-- with a contract-- one of his contractors,

working on his building, had a plane.

And we flew to New York City.

And we went to Times Square Lighting

to buy what was then all the magic lighting that was coming

because of this surge of disco.

There was a dry ice fog machine, helicopter lights that spun,

and the illuminated floor, a bubble machine,

which made the floor sticky and you would fall.

The floor was two tiers.

And it was funny.

Because when the fog machine came out,

you couldn't see the edge of the floor.

So you had people disappearing into the smoke.

(Laughter)

You could fall off the edge.

EVELYN BAILEY: Oh my gosh.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: And occasionally, a drag queen

would fall on that as well.

Because if they're performing, they

were performing through the dry ice fog,

you'd have to be careful with the edge of the stage.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Now the Red Carpet

was it strictly a gay bar?

Or was that--

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: The Red Carpet was a gay bar.

It was a piano bar.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Actually, I want to go back a little bit.

I want to talk about your first time going to Jim's.

Talk me through that experience.

And tell me, you know, when you got into it, what was it like?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Well, I was scared.

You know, it's really the first time

that I'd ever been to a gay establishment.

Coming from a really strict Latino Catholic family,

it was really taboo, you know.

And the only reason I went was because my buddies, my friends,

they dragged me out there.

And they're no you've got to come.

They were all out in Albany having a good time.

And it was interesting.

The first person I happened to meet at that bar

was a priest, a gay priest.

But he was a wonderful person, a very, very nice person.

KEVIN INDOVINO: We won't ask for a name.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: He was understanding and very patient.

Because I was scared to death half the time.

EVELYN BAILEY: Now, go back a little ways.

You're born in Rochester?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: No, I came-- we moved to Rochester in 1962

from Brooklyn.

EVELYN BAILEY: And did you know you were gay?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: I knew that I was feeling different things,

but I didn't.

And then growing up so traditional,

it wasn't until high school that I actually experimented

sexually with another male.

And it was-- it was difficult.

EVELYN BAILEY: But those became your buddies?

The guys--

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: A few of them, yes.

Those became, they became--

and we happened to all go to the same school.

So it was kind of a-- you know, we kind of hung out.

I was in a rock band too back in high school.

And they didn't know that side of me either,

you know, except my immediate friends.

EVELYN BAILEY: So it was really when you went to the U of R?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: It was in college.

College was my first really, you know, coming out,

if you want to say.

Because, you know, it was the first time that--

I like to describe it as you could--

almost like if you're breathing for the first time.

Because you're experiencing a side of your life

that you've hidden for so long.

It was very, very freeing.

You know, and it was the beginning

of that whole revolution, sexual revolution.

And it was, you know, it was OK to go to a gay bar.

Because that's where you'll hear the best

music, and the prettier people all, you know, hung out.

And if you were straight, you always had a girl next to you.

But, you know, you went to the gay bars.

If you wanted to really--

EVELYN BAILEY: So the Red Carpet?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: The Red Carpet

was my first job as a DJ in '74, '75, something around there.

I'm not quite sure.

And as I said, it was owned by Jesse Vulo.

And since I was always bringing in the tapes,

and throwing them at his tape deck, and dancing around,

he figured that I could be the DJ.

So he gave me my first opportunity to experiment.

And it was different.

We had what they call Sparta turntable.

Sparta turntables were the turntables

that they used in the radio stations.

And they were horrendous.

Because they were big, blocky, very hard.

You couldn't control the turntable.

So I used to put my thumb on the table

to slow it down and release it slowly when I made the blend.

When I blended the other record, then I released it slowly,

so it will be a smooth transition.

But all of that stuff we had to learn.

You know, I had to create.

The other thing I would do is what

we call slip que, which is-- so we would take

the cover of the 45, and we'd put it on the turntable,

put the record on top of it.

You hold the edge of the 45 cover.

And you bring your record to where you wanted it to be,

that first note that you wanted to hit,

and then you released it.

And at the same time, you switched tables.

And it continued.

The music continued.

You tried to keep the beats consistent

or build up a little bit.

It was just a very primitive way of doing it.

But we did it.

We did it great, you know.

And from that, from the Red Carpet, there was a club.

It's Merchant's Grill on Merchant's Rd.

It was called Peabody's and it was a straight club.

But the owner really liked what we were doing.

So he invited me to play on Tuesday nights.

Well, that became the best night he had.

It was a mixed crowd of straight and gay.

All the pretty people all in the place.

It was a great night.

It was like one of the nights to go out was Tuesday night

at Peabody's.

And it was mix.

It was a big mix group.

EVELYN BAILEY: Now, after the Red Carpet--

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Jim's was going.

Jim's was going at the same time.

Jim's was actually expanding.

They were putting in sound, and lighting, and, you know,

turntables, and doing everything,

you know, to become a club, a dance club.

EVELYN BAILEY: And the Red Carpet and Jim's

were at the same time.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: They ran at the same time.

EVELYN BAILEY: You mentioned Backstreets.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Backstreets didn't come into the whole

scene until the '80's.

EVELYN BAILEY: OK, the Rathskeller?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: The Rathskeller

was owned by Jesse Vulo at the same time

that the Carpet was going.

EVELYN BAILEY: He owned two?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: He owned both bars.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Where was the Rathskeller?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Do you know where the Cadillac Hotel is?

Right in that little side street,

where the DMV used to be many years ago, back in that corner,

it was like a basement level bar.

And it was a neighborhood bar.

Tony Green worked there.

I mean, a lot of people worked there.

EVELYN BAILEY: Was there dancing?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: There was no dancing.

It was strictly a small kind of little bar.

There was no dancing in there.

If you wanted dancing, you went to Jim's or you

went to the Carpet.

EVELYN BAILEY: What about the Blue Chip?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: That I'm not familiar with.

EVELYN BAILEY: Dick's 43?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Dick's 43 was way before.

That was in the sixties.

Dick's 43 was in the sixties.

That was-- I was a kid.

I was in school.

And I think that was over there off of Main Street.

And I think it might have been Jim that owned it too,

Jim Van Allen.

But I'm not sure.

EVELYN BAILEY: Bullwinkle's?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Bullwinkle's was later on.

And that was on Lake.

And that was in the eighties.

EVELYN BAILEY: Avenue Pub?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Avenue Pub has been around forever,

as long as I can remember.

EVELYN BAILEY: Forum?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: The Forum used

to be on the corner of Goodman and Main Street.

Bachelor's Forum, that was in the seventies as well.

EVELYN BAILEY: And the Avenue Pub was in the seventies?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Right.

I never went to those places.

I was strictly a Red Carpet boy.

And if I went anywhere else it will be at Jim's.

And then I left and came back in '79.

And Jesse Vulo opened Friar's of Monroe Avenue.

EVELYN BAILEY: Boy Jesse really was the bar guy.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Yeah, he was.

Him, and Jim, and Dick Thomas and Duckie, and those guys

were pretty much the bar guys.

They had a ritual.

Well, this is in the eighties.

They had a ritual that they would get together

on Sundays, all the owners, and go from bar, to bar,

to bar, just visit all the bars and drink and buy drinks,

which I thought was great.

Because it was a good social contact with your customers.

Plus, you support each other's business.

And if you look at the nights, you

went to Friar's on a Tuesday night.

Because John O'Terry and all those guys will tell you,

Tuesday night was like a Saturday night at Friar's.

And then on Wednesdays you went to Jim's.

On Thursdays, you went to the Pub.

And then on the weekends it was a free for all.

Wherever you felt comfortable was where you went.

And then on Sundays, you ended up going to Tara's or the Pub.

And then the cycle started again.

EVELYN BAILEY: Now, Tara's was a piano bar?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Piano bar.

EVELYN BAILEY: And no music?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: They did have music.

Sammy-- I forget what Sammy's name is.

It's on here.

But Sammy they played at Tara's for awhile.

They played music.

I know Sammy's been around back from my early days as well.

But he-- and when in the eighties he was playing music

at Tara's.

EVELYN BAILEY: So who were these other DJs?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Well, when I came back in 1979, myself,

I was at Friar's.

And Stephen Keen was at Jim's.

EVELYN BAILEY: Stephen King?

Keen?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Keen, K-E-E-N.

I got his little thing here.

Where is it?

Oh, here it is.

And I had Henry Peron was my little protege and wannabe

DJ at the time.

And he had Richie, who happened to be his boyfriend.

And-- but that's all in here too as well.

But it was myself.

Doing the Red Carpet, it was myself, Blair Johnson,

and Tommy Lamphier.

They were my backups at the Red Carpet.

EVELYN BAILEY: Tommy?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Lamphier.

I don't even know how to spell it L-A-M-P-H-E-I=-R?

I can find out for you.

I'm still waiting for Cheryl.

Cheryl Martin was supposed to give me a little bio.

Women DJs were Cheryl, Jackie Jones, Cindy Evely.

EVELYN BAILEY: Wait a minute.

Women's, Jackie?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Jackie Jones.

She was at Rosie's, Cheryl was at Rosie's.

Cindy Evely, she played like the boys,

so she worked the boy bars.

There was another young lady.

Her name was Tony.

She's a police officer, but she worked at Rosie's.

EVELYN BAILEY: Cavalera?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: I don't remember her last name.

I just knew her as Tony.

I don't know if she was Latino or black.

But she, you know, she was a dark complexion and she was--

EVELYN BAILEY: The Riverview didn't have music?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: The Riverview didn't have music.

EVELYN BAILEY: That was just a--

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: That was just a bar.

And they didn't like the guys.

(Laughter)

They didn't want the guys there.

EVELYN BAILEY: They let some guys in.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Oh, yeah, they did.

I mean, you know, but I remember dropping off

my friend, Lydia, at the Riverview,

and then heading over to Jim's, and then coming back

and picking her up drunk as a skunk,

and going home, and taking her home.

But that was then.

It was a thing.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Can you, in that period of mid-seventies

into the eighties, give us a sense

of really these places being the only place gay men

and women had to socialize?

What was it like?

And actually, in a lot of ways, it was a very exciting time.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: It was an exciting time-- well,

especially in the seventies, because, all of a sudden,

there's this explosion.

The whole disco era was really a gay thing.

It came from the underground gay clubs in New York City.

The Loft and The Gallery were very much

underground gay clubs.

And the whole concept of DJ, the industry itself,

everything from creating the ambience to the technology,

it came from the gay community.

You know, you had--

some of my favorite DJs in the world are from New York.

Nicky Schiano, he was the owner of The Gallery and David

Mancuso.

But Nicky was probably the first DJ

that I ever heard that just kind of manipulated

and controlled the room, that knew how to create an ambience.

And he surrounded himself by really creative people.

Some of the better DJs, to this day, they're still around.

Frankie Knuckles, you know, Larry Levine.

Larry Levine was a major DJ at the Club Paradise

Garage in New York.

But he was a major DJ.

I mean, if you look at the history,

If you look at that book, if you start reading that book,

it's really great.

It gives you a really good insight

as to the whole movement.

And what's funny is, I lived it.

I lived that whole thing.

These are the clubs that I went to

and that it piqued my interest in becoming a DJ.

Because I was a musician.

I was in a band.

I was in a Latin band and a rock band.

And it just seemed like a normal transition

to go into this other new thing.

Because it was music.

And, you know, I used my musical abilities

to be able to blend and create a mix.

But these guys back then were--

these were the godfather of all of this stuff.

And so in the middle of the seventies when it all blew up,

this whole disco movement, and the straight people

thought it was like the-- you know,

that was old in our community.

So if you wanted to go--

in Rochester, if you wanted to go to the 747, or 2001,

and all those clubs, you could go to those places.

But it was very commercialized.

If you wanted to hear new music, you came to Friar's or you went

to Jim's.

And the people that were straight, that really

loved the music, that's where they came.

And that's where they went.

They came, and they mingled in with the gay community

and had a ball.

EVELYN BAILEY: So what was the Red Carpet?

The night it opened, were you there?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: The Red Carpet

when it opened as a dance club?

Absolutely, I was the DJ.

EVELYN BAILEY: What was it like?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: It was phenomenal.

You could-- I mean, here's this new place.

It was clean, and new, and the lighting, and sound, and things

that you never really saw.

You know, the helicopter lights, these

were lights that spun around like this.

It was funny.

Because it was one night after awhile,

they spun so much that one came loose and just came crashing

down on the dance floor.

Luckily, nobody got hurt.

But they were all new things, you know.

And at the time, we had those Sparta turntables,

which were not really practical to work with.

And a little Shure mixer about this big, A little Shure

mixer with four knobs, and that's how you did your mixing,

you know, back and forth.

But it was what was there, you know?

EVELYN BAILEY: And the people?

Ages?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: All ages, a lot of my friends

that were in high school-- that shouldn't have never

been at the bars-- were in the bars dancing and carrying on.

EVELYN BAILEY: African-American?

Hispanic?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Everybody.

Blair Johnson was African-American,

Tommie Lanphier was a white boy, and then myself,

so the three of us were over at the Red Carpet.

You know, it was everybody that you can think of.

It was a great--

it was a big melting pot.

EVELYN BAILEY: Were you ever there--

or was the Red Carpet ever raided?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: It was never raided.

What happened with the Red Carpet,

during the week it opened as a piano bar, you know.

And a gentleman was picked up by someone, took somebody home,

and was murdered.

And they gave it really, really bad publicity.

And so eventually it closed.

The Red Carpet closed.

But, you know, that was just--

you know how the media works.

They jump on.

I think he was a teacher at East High School.

So that was a big scandal.

EVELYN BAILEY: Were you ever in a bar that was raided?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Never.

I wasn't.

Maybe in the sixties, like Dick's 43 and those places.

But not in-- well, that's not true.

Tom Voight, when he took over Whispers,

brought in some boys dancers from Toronto.

And the bar got raided because they exposed themselves.

KEVIN INDOVINO: But that was in the eighties though,

almost late eighties.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Yeah, it was late eighties.

EVELYN BAILEY: But Jim's was raided on North Street.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Jim's, maybe in its day.

But I never was there when that happened.

Maybe, even as I said, Jim's was late sixties early seventies.

Seventies, sixties.

Pat Burns was there.

Pat Burns was the first person I ever heard play music anywhere.

I mean, it was the first bar, so he was it,

as far as the first DJ, if you even want to call him that.

And he was there for a long time.

I went off to Europe, and he was still there.

(Laughter)

KEVIN INDOVINO: Did you have a sense, other than just having

a great time, and playing music, and getting dizzy

by lights and all that stuff, did you

have any sense of what was really going on in that time

about--

(pause in recording)

Again, aside from all the music, and the dancing,

and the lights, and everybody having a great time,

did you get any sense that this really

was also the awakening or the coming

out of the gay community?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Yeah, it was--

I mean, you definitely knew that everything was changing.

People's attitudes were changing.

And you could tell by just the clubs.

I mean, Peabody's, it was a straight club.

On Tuesday nights, they would do a mixed crowd.

They brought in a DJ that had a big gay following,

and you had a mix of people.

Yeah, you definitely saw that whole--

it was just not the sexual revolution.

It was a movement.

You could see people starting to be more open about who they

were and the country taking a different turn

and a little bit of a different attitude.

Not to the extent that it is today, obviously,

but it was a start.

You definitely saw it.

We took a we took a hit.

I mean as a community, I think we

took a hit during that whole AIDS epidemic.

Because there was not a lot of activity.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Let's not brush over that.

Talk to me a little bit about that.

What did you witness at the bars when AIDS really

became oh my god, what is this unknown thing that we

have to be afraid of?

What did you see starting to happen.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Well, you know, unfortunately, Jesse Vulo

was probably one of the first people

in our community, prominent person in our community,

to be afflicted.

And at that time, we really didn't

know what we're dealing with as a community.

But we saw this whole development of the disease.

And then eventually all the information started coming out.

And there were all kinds of-- and people were afraid.

People were in a bit of a panic.

Because you didn't know what was really going on.

EVELYN BAILEY: How did that affect the bar scene?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: I think in the middle eighties there,

you did see a drop in the bars.

But people still needed an escape.

They still wanted to go and be amongst people

that they feel comfortable.

So you really didn't see--

you saw some, but not really as drastic.

I think people were just more careful

as to how they'd approach--

EVELYN BAILEY: Was there less drinking?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Oh, less drinking came around

because of the change of--

I think there might have been a little bit more

drinking because people were stressed out.

But it didn't seem to me like there was less drinking.

You still had people that came out.

You needed that escape.

EVELYN BAILEY: So tell me about Jesse Vulo.

What kind of a guy was he?

What kind of a man was he, who would buy three, four bars?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: His family was into real estate.

They owned a lot of real estate.

They owned the building where the Carpet was.

They owned that whole block.

They owned the building where Friar's was.

They owned the building where the Rathskeller was.

I mean, they were into real estate.

He was a very charismatic man.

Originally, I think he was born in Africa.

He came from a rather affluent Italian family.

And he was just a very, very-- he was--

I remember him to be--

he was a great friend.

He was my boss.

But he was also a wonderful friend.

And just people really held him in high esteem.

He was a good community person.

He loved to have fun.

He liked to party.

EVELYN BAILEY: Did he associate with his customers?

I mean--

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Oh, absolutely.

There were great parties at his house.

We had wonderful gatherings at his place.

Yes, absolutely, yeah, he was very, very much.

EVELYN BAILEY: He also owned Mother's at one point,

didn't he?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: No he never owned Mother's.

No, he passed before Mother's.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Long before Mother's opened.

I mean, it was 40 South Union for years, and years,

and years.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Yeah, 40 South Union for a long time

before then.

EVELYN BAILEY: Talk to me a little bit

about the bar culture and the bar owner kind of camaraderie.

Or, I mean, to have bar owners go from bar to bar

to bar on a Sunday was unusual.

Because they were all in competition

with each other for business.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: They were and they weren't.

Because I think they respected each other's nights.

You knew that on Tuesday, the place to be was Friar's.

You knew that on Wednesdays, people were going to go

to Jim's.

And you knew that on Thursdays people

were going to congregate at The Pub and so on.

So, I mean, I think there was a mutual respect

for each other's nights and working together.

And I think that's where that whole concept of them

getting together on Sundays and just doing this whole rosary,

as I called it, procession from bar

to bar buying their customers drinks

and having the people see them.

So it was a more united community.

I remember pulling the sound system out

at Friar's, and dragging it with us to the picnic,

and setting it up for music at the picnics,

and then dragging it back, and putting it all back in place,

so that we can party.

But Jesse was one of the first people

that did that for the community, you know.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Let me touch on that a little bit more.

Talk about the bar's involvement in gay pride activities,

like the picnic.

What were you seeing?

And what were you involved with?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Well, the picnic--

I got involved in the picnic when I came back from Europe.

And I worked for Jesse.

And they were willing to drag the sound system out there.

And we were willing to play.

And I think in the beginning, we didn't play actual records.

We would bring tapes, mix tapes.

Jesse also had a great collection

of-- before he actually put a DJ in Friar's, he would

go to New York City, because the scene was so big,

and he would get all these great gay disc

jockeys to make these reel-to-reels for him.

And he would play them in the back room.

And people would just dance.

And it was continuous DJ music.

And when I came back from Europe,

then he said, "I want you to play."

And we set up a booth, and we did all that stuff.

And we played live.

But we would take--

to the picnics, we would take tapes, because--

well, we had that really dusty little pavilion.

And you couldn't take your records there.

It was terrible.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Give me a sense of your experience,

and you're there and you're seeing--

I mean, up at the height of these picnics,

there would be three thousand people there.

I mean, what was that like?

How did it make you feel?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: It was--

again, it's that feeling that I had when I was in college,

where I was breathing for the first time, where

I was where I was being myself.

And at the picnic it was very public.

But yet, you were OK.

You were comfortable.

Because you were surrounded by three thousand people that

looked at life the same way you did.

So you definitely were a lot more comfortable.

EVELYN BAILEY: The bars, at one point,

though really donated the food and--

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: The drinks, the food, everything.

Everybody just kind of dragged everything out.

EVELYN BAILEY: And I think Jim's was the first bar that

funded the picnic.

And then there was a group.

Talk to me about what it took at the picnic

to get the crowd going in that dance pavilion.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Not much, just good music.

It was different times.

I'm telling you, those were some of the best times.

Because people really knew how to have a good time.

They came out, they came out to have a good time.

The picnics today are wonderful.

They're really nice, elaborate setups and everything else.

But it's like pulling teeth to get

those people at that pavilion sometimes to get them going.

And it's usually the last few hours of the day

that they're really having a good old time.

I don't know if it's because of the drinks get to their heads

or what it is.

But in the beginning, people just--

they just had a good time.

It was any opportunity to get together.

And it just seemed to me--

I don't know-- that was my perception.

EVELYN BAILEY: Now, I know you were a Red Carpet man.

But talk to me about Tony Green.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Well, I didn't get to know Tony until

Friar's.

And Tony Green was the entertainment at the bar

at Friar's.

I mean, it was between him and Ron Gucchino.

They just knew you.

You would walk into Friar's.

And before you could approach the bar,

your drink was already on the bar.

He knew you.

He was very personable.

He knew what you were drinking.

I mean, it was just a given.

You knew that Tony would be there to take care of it.

He was a lot of fun.

EVELYN BAILEY: What was his favorite name to call people?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Mary.

Everybody was Mary.

He'd call me concha.

Concha is a shell.

And it's a very Spanish.

It's like Mary, but in Spanish.

And Tony, you know, was Spaniard.

And so he spoke Spanish.

But he said he would call me concha.

And we'd have a great time.

He'd also do--

I remember getting together every Thanksgiving.

Because he'd throw a Thanksgiving gathering

at his house for all the people that

didn't have any place to go.

And everybody would bring something to pass.

And it was just a great time.

We'd have a good time.

I mean, not that I didn't have any place to go.

But I wanted to go because it was fun.

Yeah, Tony Green was great.

He was he was a wonderful person.

And eventually, Tony Green and a few others

bought Friar's and ran it.

EVELYN BAILEY: Do you remember when that was?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: I don't.

Mid-eighties.

I know Jesse had passed.

And Bob Sevini, who was Jesse's lover, he ran it for a while

and then decided that he wanted to sell it.

And there were a couple of people that came at the play.

And Tony was one.

I think it was a few of the bartenders.

EVELYN BAILEY: Now, Buddy Wegman.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: I knew Buddy.

EVELYN BAILEY: Talk to me about Buddy.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: What can I say?

These guys were great people.

They were really charismatic.

I only could tell you, I came to meet them and deal with them

in the bar sets.

And so that's where--

I mean, a few of them I knew better, like Jesse and Tony

I knew better than Buddy.

But these were great people in our community.

They took the risks.

EVELYN BAILEY: Buddy had Tara's.

Do you know that AIDS Rochester began upstairs?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Yeah, I do.

I do remember that.

EVELYN BAILEY: He had a woman who worked for him.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: I remember her name--

EVELYN BAILEY: Renee, Renee Lippa.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Renee Lippa.

Yeah, Renee Lippa.

EVELYN BAILEY: Was she his bar manager?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: She was the bar manager, yeah.

Yeah, Renee partied with us many a times.

EVELYN BAILEY: Now talk to me a little bit about the difference

between a piano bar, like Tara's, and Friar's.

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Well, Friar's was a dance club.

I mean, it was a dance club during the week.

And during the day, because it was open during the day.

And people in the neighborhood stopped in.

And people went over there for a cocktail

after hours, and after work, and stuff like that.

But Friar's was definitely known for its dance ambience.

And back then, you don't have the social media

that we have today.

You wanted to meet people, you had to go out.

Friar's was a unique setting because it

had a round bar, which made cruising a lot of fun.

Because you sat across from somebody that you thought

was good looking, and it was just a natural.

And that was a very different--

I mean, today's scene is so different.

But I think it's more sociable back

in the days of Friar's and those places.

People just went out and met people,

and they had more communication.

EVELYN BAILEY: And at a piano bar,

you always had to have someone playing--

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Sometimes, sometimes.

EVELYN BAILEY: Did people sing?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Yeah, at Tara's I

remember people singing and playing.

Yeah, most definitely.

And I know that at the Red Carpet

they did it as well back before he turned it

into the nightclub.

I'm trying to remember whether the bartender at the Red

Carpet-- was it Pat?

What was Pat's last name?

He was funny, hysterical.

Oh my god I can't remember his name.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Talk to me about the drag queens.

When did they start becoming an attraction?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Well, they were always an attraction

at Jim's.

Jim's always seemed to have the drag queens.

When the Carpet opened, there's some drag queens

that came over there as well.

But they always kind of cross back and forth.

There were always drag queens at both bars.

And Friar's did not have as many drag queens.

But they did have some.

Maya was a Friar's child, as I call it.

But Friar's also brought some of the first national performers.

They brought Divine.

I mean they brought some people.

EVELYN BAILEY: So searching your memory,

who was the first drag queen--

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: The first drag queen I can remember

was Freddie Baths.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Freddie who?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: Freddie Baths.

I think that's the right way to pronounce his--

and he used to do a lot of--

well, it was a lot of Broadway, and Ethel Merman,

and Barbra Streisand.

But he was probably one of the first ones I remember.

There was a drag queen at the Red Carpet.

Her name was-- they called her Ginger.

Never knew her real name.

But there were a really beautiful one.

And recently I saw a picture on Facebook.

And I can't remember her name.

But she was probably the closest thing to a transgender

that we've seen in Rochester back then.

I'm trying to remember.

I'm going to have to look it up.

Because I know I saw it.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Let me ask you this,

were they referred to as drag queens back then?

Or were they female impersonators?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: They've always been drag queens.

KEVIN INDOVINO: Were they singing themselves

or were they lip syncing?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: They were mostly lip syncing.

There was a performer at the Red Carpet, older gentleman,

they used to call Grandma--

what was his name?

And he used his own voice.

And he had a whole act.

He did this whole thing.

I can't remember the name.

It was funny because he has false teeth.

And they would get loose in the middle of his act.

And you'd hear him.

(Laughter)

And he wouldn't hide it.

He would just work it in as part of his act.

He'd do a striptease, and he'd pull out chickens.

He did all kinds of stuff.

It was a good show.

I mean, it was basically a good show.

It was more of--

they did a lot of Broadway and a lot of--

KEVIN INDOVINO: In your opinion, why do you

think the drag queens became so strongly

associated with the gay community?

HECTOR ARGUINZONI: I don't know.

It was never-- personally, I never really knew too much

about the drag queen scene until into I got it into Marcelo's

and Mother's and those places.

Because they elevate it to a different level.

It became part of their ambience and the quality

of the performers were exceptional.

It just became a whole different level.

But in the early days, I don't remember too many.

There were definitely some.

I know Jimmy Catalano used to do Carmen Miranda.

And Rondretta, she used to do a lot of Diana Ross.

KEVIN INDOVINO: What's her name used to do Liza?