Audio Interview, Stanley Byrd, April 5, 2013

  • EVELYN BAILEY: Today is April 5th,
  • and I'm here at the University of Rochester
  • talking to Dr. Stanley Byrd, who was a student here
  • at the U of R from 1972 to '74, and has now working
  • at the U of R as an organizational developmental
  • specialist for the University.
  • So Stanley, or Stan, were you born in Rochester?
  • STANLEY BYRD: No, I was born in Florida.
  • But I've lived here most of my life.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And when did you first come to New York?
  • Was it as a student?
  • STANLEY BYRD: No, 1958.
  • As a child.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And so you grew up--
  • STANLEY BYRD: I grew up in Rochester.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: In the city.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yes.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And what was the city like at that time?
  • Was there, to your knowledge, a gay community?
  • Was there any talk about LGBT issues?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Well, I came out when I was twenty-one.
  • So that was in 1975.
  • And I have to say at that time for me there was a lot of fear
  • around being a gay person any place.
  • Certainly what I heard about bars being available
  • and other things like that, other social avenues,
  • I didn't partake of until I was about twenty years old.
  • And part of the fear was, I mean,
  • from what I remember at that time,
  • it was still illegal for same-sex people to dance,
  • and that the clubs were still being raided.
  • I mean, I remember going to clubs that were raided.
  • So there was a lot of fear during that period.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Do you recall whether there was--
  • a sense there was more harassment by police,
  • by city officials at that time?
  • Because we have recorded stories of people
  • being harassed outside bars by police, being stopped, being
  • questioned.
  • And the police notoriously went through the areas
  • taking down license plate numbers with the caveat
  • that they wanted to know who was in the area
  • if a crime was committed somewhere in that area.
  • I mean, that's pretty far-fetched.
  • But were you aware?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Very aware, because there was always
  • a police presence, particularly on the weekends.
  • There were always police hanging out around the bar.
  • I mean, I was even fearful going in
  • because you have these folks in uniform,
  • like, watching you as you went into the bar.
  • Police would walk through the bars,
  • you know, just sort of checking out things and seeing
  • what was going on.
  • And occasionally we felt--
  • I certainly felt fearful when several police came in.
  • And it felt like--
  • I mean, it was a raid, and basically
  • they were just walking through to see what was going on.
  • And like I said, I think at that point in time
  • there was still some strangeness around same-sex people dancing
  • together.
  • So people would scatter and sort of go to their mutual areas,
  • and just sip on their drinks, et cetera,
  • while they were going through.
  • So I do remember that.
  • I mean, certainly when I first started going out to the bars,
  • that was still happening.
  • And that was, like, '74, '75.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And here on campus,
  • were you a member of the Gay Liberation Front?
  • Or were you a member of the--
  • well, by then, '73, they had left the campus.
  • But there was a presence here.
  • It may have been called Pride--
  • STANLEY BYRD: It was the Gay Liberation Front.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Gay Liberation Front.
  • STANLEY BYRD: It was the Gay Liberation Front.
  • So in the summer of '72--
  • I actually started here the summer before my freshman year.
  • And I don't know how I heard, but I heard
  • that there was this gay group.
  • And so I wanted to explore this part of my life.
  • And I do remember I was told that they
  • met in the Anderson building.
  • I think that was the building, the Anderson dorms.
  • And I remember it took me weeks to get up
  • the courage to go up there.
  • And I went to the Anderson building.
  • There was no meeting going on, but there
  • were the Empty Closet, or I'm not
  • sure what it was callled then.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Empty Closet.
  • STANLEY BYRD: There were copies of that lying around.
  • And even picking that up, I visibly
  • shook, because it's like I was touching something that
  • related to being gay, you know?
  • Based on all of the fear.
  • And so that was kind of how I knew that there
  • was something on campus.
  • But at that time, I was still too closeted and too fearful
  • to come out.
  • I wouldn't have ever thought about joining any group.
  • And also being an African-American man, well,
  • that's the farthest thing from my mind
  • was to join a gay group.
  • But I do remember going to Anderson,
  • finding the Empty Closet newsletter,
  • and being thrilled and excited at seeing it
  • but at the same time very fearful
  • that someone was going to see me picking up the newsletter.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Do you happen to know
  • if there were more formal meetings going on
  • on campus with the group?
  • STANLEY BYRD: I can't quite remember
  • how I found out that there were more formal meetings going on.
  • I mean, that's why I found out about Anderson.
  • I don't remember how I found all that information out.
  • But somehow I found it out.
  • It may have been my roommate because my roommate was gay.
  • And he was actually more out than I was,
  • and so he was exploring all kinds of possibilities.
  • And so I'm thinking that may have been the person who
  • shared it with me.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Do you recall a dean
  • by the name of Flora Burton?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Not at all, no.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: OK.
  • Once you graduated from the U of R?
  • STANLEY BYRD: I didn't graduate from the U of R.
  • I was only here for two years and I
  • transferred to another school.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: OK In Rochester, outside of Rochester?
  • STANLEY BYRD: I'm sorry.
  • I finished up my degree at Brockport.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: OK, so you've been in Rochester since 1959.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Well, I lived in Boston for a year.
  • That's where I went to initially after leaving University
  • of Rochester.
  • And I lived in Cleveland for a year.
  • But otherwise, I've been in Rochester the whole time.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: OK, when did you become
  • involved with AIDS Rochester?
  • And prior to that question, let me ask you,
  • as an African-American male who is also
  • gay, what was the more pressing issue for you?
  • Was it your African-American heritage or was it being gay?
  • I mean, you were both.
  • Which presented the most conflict or the most
  • disruption?
  • STANLEY BYRD: I would have to say, even
  • to this day, the one that's most present for me
  • is being African-American.
  • There are some places where people
  • wouldn't know that I was gay.
  • So for some folks, that was invisible.
  • But I can't hide my race.
  • I can't have the tone of my--
  • the color of my skin and all that.
  • So those are the places--
  • I mean, even on this campus back then,
  • it was strange because I didn't feel connected
  • to any of the groups here.
  • And my experience even on this campus as a black person
  • is even though I was in the top 5 percent of my class,
  • I was put in a special program.
  • And that's why I was here the summer of '72.
  • And it's not a program that I needed, but I'm black
  • and I was put in with all the other black students who
  • got EOP funds.
  • I didn't get anything, but I was still
  • placed with that group because, I think, of my race.
  • So that stood out more for me than anything else.
  • Like I said, I didn't come out to myself
  • wholly until I was twenty-one.
  • So that was a couple of years after my experience here.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Now, the University
  • was founded as a Baptist University.
  • It was certainly founded because of technology,
  • and at the same time, RIT had Mechanics Institute.
  • And they were really the technological place to be.
  • But the University picked up some of that and expanded it.
  • Both agreed to bring diversity into this community because
  • of the creativity, the intellect,
  • and the melting pot would create new opportunities,
  • new businesses, new ideas.
  • And actually, that's-- when you look at the history
  • of Rochester, at one point there were fifteen railroads that
  • came into this town.
  • And the canal was the gateway to the west.
  • And so it was a natural place for many, many people
  • to come and create a new vision, and new work experience.
  • Was there more of an influence here
  • in the U of R about religion, religious beliefs,
  • at that point during your time here?
  • Or had that kind of--
  • STANLEY BYRD: I have to say to you
  • that for those years leading up to me applying
  • to the University and being accepted,
  • I thought that people of Jewish faith
  • were the primary group that was coming here.
  • That's all that I heard was that it was a Jewish university.
  • So it's interesting for me to hear
  • you say that it was founded on the Baptist religion.
  • And so I had this sense that this was a Jewish institution
  • that I was entering, and whatever went along
  • with that at the time.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And when you got involved with AIDS Rochester,
  • were you working?
  • Did you have a job?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yes, yes.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And what brought you to AIDS Rochester?
  • Why did you become involved with that organization, and when?
  • STANLEY BYRD: My best friend was one of the first ten people
  • in this county to die of AIDS in 1984.
  • It still makes me feel very emotional.
  • There was very little they could do for him, of course,
  • at that time.
  • The medications were all new and all that.
  • And so I felt that I needed to give something back.
  • I mean, and I tried to find ways to help
  • other people who were going through what he went through.
  • And so I worked as a volunteer case manager.
  • I think it was either '85 to '87 or '87 to '89.
  • I can't quite remember the date.
  • But I worked as a volunteer case manager for two years.
  • The majority of the folks who were assigned to me
  • were African-American.
  • So they signed the African-American clients to me.
  • And the most I could do at that time was be at their bedside
  • and be there when their families came
  • so that they had someone to sort of help them negotiate it.
  • And even with several of the clients that I
  • had who were in hospital at this point in time,
  • they were telling their families that they had cancer.
  • They didn't talk about--
  • they cautioned me, don't say anything
  • about me being gay or bi, ever.
  • As far as my family knows, I have cancer.
  • And so I had to be very thoughtful as I
  • was interacting with families.
  • At that time, I was going to individuals' homes
  • to check up on them.
  • And so as a volunteer, I had to take on notes
  • as a volunteer case manager.
  • And so it was very different.
  • But I did it for two years.
  • And I did it, like I said, because it
  • was such a devastation to lose my best friend to that disease,
  • and not be able to help him.
  • It really, really hurt me not to be
  • able to do anything to make them feel
  • more comfortable other than being present with them,
  • et cetera.
  • And so I just wanted to do something more than that.
  • And that's why I went to ARI, AIDS Rochester,
  • and decided to be a case manager.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And at that time, Jackie Nudd--
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yes.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: --was executive director.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Was executive director, yes.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Was Michael Beatty there?
  • STANLEY BYRD: No.
  • No, Michael wasn't there.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: He didn't come until much later.
  • STANLEY BYRD: I'm thinking there is a Pat something.
  • I can't think of her name.
  • There was a nurse that did a lot of the clinical pieces.
  • I thought her name started with Pat.
  • So I interact with her a lot.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Did you interact with, perhaps, Sue Cowell?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yes, yeah, I've known Sue for--
  • EVELYN BAILEY: In the health department?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yes, I've known Sue for a very long time,
  • starting, probably, with AIDS Rochester.
  • Yes.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Bill Valenti, of course, was--
  • I'm trying to recall when Community Health Network began
  • in relationship to AIDS Rochester,
  • because they were doing research and Bill was much more focused
  • on patient care and pushed to move out of U or R
  • and develop his own clinic and his own--
  • he recalls that 1981 was the first time
  • he heard or encountered the AIDS complex here in Rochester.
  • They identified-- there was one of their patients
  • at the University came through, and Bill
  • had read the information and the description of Kaposi's
  • sarcoma.
  • And he identified this person as being the first person
  • he ran into with AIDS in 1981.
  • And then there was a whole--
  • well, it was one person out of how many.
  • And then as the disease progressed, of course,
  • by 1984, '85, it was epidemic.
  • And just left and right, men, primarily gay men, were dying.
  • Every other week we were going to funerals.
  • And it was a time, I think, when the community really
  • came together to support the men who had AIDS,
  • and to provide financial aid and assistance.
  • Because each HPA, Helping People with AIDS, began in 1986.
  • Can you speak to that climate at all?
  • When you were a caseworker, did you
  • find the gay community coming together
  • as a supportive group for friends,
  • for relatives, for people they knew?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Well, certainly with ARI,
  • I realize that there was a coming together
  • in the community.
  • And certainly all the people at that point in time I think
  • were gay and lesbian folks who were really
  • trying to rally around the group, around the epidemic.
  • And helping people with AIDS, I was
  • very aware of that because I was trying
  • to connect some of the clients I work with to that organization.
  • But once again, I was working primarily
  • with African-American individuals.
  • And I didn't feel the same kind of support
  • for that group of individuals.
  • It really was just sort of me making sure
  • that I took great notes so that whatever next level of care
  • they needed, they received that.
  • But I think-- and as we go on to our other topic around MOCHA,
  • I think that's one of the reasons why
  • an organization like that was created.
  • There wasn't a sense that black men were recognized
  • as part of this epidemic.
  • Because at that time, it was predominantly white men
  • who were showing up.
  • It doesn't mean that there weren't
  • black men dying from it.
  • But it was white men who were showing up with the disease.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And how long after that
  • did you become involved with MOCHA
  • Were you still in Rochester?
  • And no longer, I--
  • or maybe you no longer were with AIDS Rochester.
  • STANLEY BYRD: No, not at that point in time.
  • So MOCHA has been around to 1996.
  • But if I could just talk about the whole community health
  • network.
  • One of the things about community health network
  • is it was in the Rochester-- it was in the same building
  • as the Rochester Center for Independent
  • Living on South Avenue.
  • And so Gary English was Americorp volunteer
  • at the Rochester Center for Independent Living, OK?
  • So they allowed space for him to plant the seed for MOCHA.
  • So it's really incredible that we had this health care
  • center that was supporting folks with HIV and AIDS,
  • and then we have this person who had a vision who was actually
  • right next door at the Rochester Center for Independent Living.
  • And they allowed him the time and energy
  • and support to sort of start looking
  • at the issue related to African-American and black men.
  • And so I met Gary probably in late '94, '95,
  • and we were engaged in conversations
  • about what the grant would look like
  • and what we could do with the grant and those kinds
  • of things.
  • And so he had great support in writing the grant,
  • I think, from the Department of Health as well.
  • And so he was able to get the grant that
  • is what started MOCHA.
  • And at that point in time, he decided to-- he appointed me
  • as first board member of MOCHA.
  • So in 1996, I became the first board member in MOCHA.
  • And MOCHA lived in the Center for Independent Living
  • for three to four years.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Side by side with CHN.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yes, so MOCHA lived in the Center
  • for Independent Living.
  • They provided us with three or four cubicles and an office.
  • There's an office for the director,
  • and then the staff, the outreach staff, the health educators,
  • et cetera, worked in the cubicles.
  • So I mean, Rochester Independent Living under Tim Weider.
  • Tim really saw the need, too, and the vision
  • of supporting Gary, I think, in creating this new organization
  • that was much needed.
  • So it's an interesting story.
  • And when you think about the linkages--
  • EVELYN BAILEY: The connections.
  • STANLEY BYRD: And the connections, yeah.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And that's one of the things that's, I believe,
  • unique to Rochester.
  • Because the connections and the intersections of those
  • connections are how we have become a city that is not only
  • gay friendly, but very open to diversity, very welcoming
  • of practically any religious group and any ethnic group.
  • We'll get to that later, but--
  • say, talk to me a little bit about Gary English
  • in terms of his vision, in terms of what he wanted to do.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Well, Gary, I'm not sure how he--
  • I think working with the Department of Health,
  • one of the things he noticed is that black African-American men
  • weren't receiving the kind of services.
  • He also had, I think, friends, and I
  • don't know this for a fact, but I'm
  • assuming he had friends who were suffering from HIV and AIDS
  • as well, and he was realizing that many of those individuals
  • would not go to a white clinic for support and for help.
  • They wouldn't go to ARI because some folks--
  • I don't want to use the word--
  • some folks were private about their sexual orientation.
  • I don't like to use the word "down-low" because "down-low"
  • has a connotation that it's only black men.
  • But white men are also, if you're
  • going to use that term, on the down-low
  • too around their sexual activities.
  • So his vision was certainly creating
  • a space where African-American men, black men, Latino men
  • would feel comfortable going to to at least seek
  • services that would connect them to the broader services.
  • One of the things that we did is we partner with individuals
  • to go get tested because there was a lot of fear
  • around getting tested and going to this (unintelligible)
  • in this institution.
  • A lot of the testing happened at the health department then.
  • And so, I mean, to go there and--
  • I remember going there and being tested myself.
  • And it was the Westfall Road.
  • And you go and they put folks who
  • are being tested for HIV behind this great, big screen or wall.
  • So first of all, we had walk into this place
  • and be tested for HIV with all the connotations
  • an et cetera behind that.
  • And then they set us in this hallway
  • with this wall that they--
  • with this temporary wall that was put there.
  • And then we were waiting there to be
  • tested and just terrified, I mean,
  • about the possible results.
  • But so Gary realized that--
  • certainly he didn't feel that the African-American men
  • were getting the same level of treatment and support.
  • Part of that was because folks, really, I think,
  • needed to see other people like themselves
  • in whatever environment they found themselves in.
  • And they certainly didn't feel that
  • with some of the organizations that were occurring.
  • I mean, out of all of that also Gary
  • felt that there was a need for a pulling together
  • of the black community.
  • So that's why in addition to what eventually became
  • case management and health educators, et cetera,
  • we also did things that were more fun.
  • Like the annual picnic and those kinds of things.
  • So his vision was really not just about HIV and AIDS
  • and making sure that people have support for that.
  • His vision was about how do we pull
  • the black, African-American, Latino community together
  • in the same way that the white community was pulling together,
  • to meet the needs of our individuals
  • who are suffering HIV and AIDS.
  • So it was a broad vision that was about certainly
  • the health care related to HIV and AIDS,
  • but also about the social-emotional needs.
  • And I think that's the biggest piece that we still struggle
  • with, I think, even today.
  • And that the social-emotional needs may be a little different
  • because of people's families of origin
  • and how they were treated and all those kinds of things.
  • So broad vision.
  • And Gary was a young man.
  • So it was an incredible vision.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Can you tell me just a little bit
  • about the energy that he exuded?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Well, Gary definitely
  • was an extrovert and very passionate about this work.
  • And I think that's why he was able to, when
  • he went into rooms and he was trying to share with folks,
  • he was trying to do.
  • I think that's why he was able to convince them.
  • He was very passionate about the work.
  • It was really clear that this was a person who was not just
  • a talker, but that he was going to also make himself involved
  • in making all of this happen.
  • But I don't know if you've heard anything about Gary,
  • but he's a very passionate extrovert who is a charmer.
  • So he would go into, like, different rooms
  • and present what he needed to present
  • and, I think, basically, just charmed individuals
  • into seeing his vision.
  • I mean, really seeing the vision and seeing the need for it.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And you've remained connected to MOCHA
  • over the years--
  • STANLEY BYRD: Absolutely.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: --in various capacities.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Actually, so I was the board
  • chair for three years.
  • And then we got an additional grant for case management.
  • And so at that point, I became a staff person.
  • And I was the MOCHA services coordinator.
  • And because of my background in HR,
  • so I wrote their policy procedure manual,
  • and I wrote the case management manual.
  • And then that's when we started training people
  • on different intervention techniques,
  • like many voices, many men, those kind of techniques
  • that we work with in conjunction with the Department of Health,
  • and--
  • I'm trying to think of the woman we work with directly.
  • She's still there.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Department of Health?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yes.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Kim Smith?
  • STANLEY BYRD: No, her husband is the director
  • of the Department of Health.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Darlene--
  • STANLEY BYRD: If I can remember the last name.
  • I'm so sorry that I can't remember it.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: No, that's all right.
  • STANLEY BYRD: But we work directly, really
  • directly with those individuals.
  • And so I was a staff person then for another two and a half,
  • three years because we had gotten additional grants.
  • And so the program was expanding at that point in time
  • to include case management.
  • Because before that, it was really just outreach,
  • sort of we parallel HPA in some of our outreach.
  • We did lots of outreach and education programs
  • in the community and those kinds of things.
  • But I think it was the case management piece that really
  • enabled us to feel like we were providing an expanded
  • service in connecting folks to what they needed service-wise.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Right.
  • Was it MOCHA that began the mobile unit
  • or was it AIDS Rochester?
  • STANLEY BYRD: I'm sure it was AIDS Rochester that
  • had been at the mobile unit.
  • We didn't have the resources, really,
  • to do something at that level.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: But you began to do testing at your offices,
  • I believe.
  • STANLEY BYRD: I'm thinking--
  • I'm not sure, because at the time that it was in the off--
  • I'll put it this way.
  • At the time that we're in the Rochester Independent Living,
  • there wasn't the privacy to do that.
  • We began testing when we moved to the Sibley building.
  • So one of the things I did under my tenure is I moved--
  • we had moved from independent living to,
  • I think, the ninth floor, I think, of the Sibley building.
  • So we had a wonderful space there.
  • And that's when we really started getting
  • lots of community members.
  • Because it wasn't associated with independent living
  • because, you know, there was this sense now,
  • am I going because I need some other support later
  • to disabilities, et cetera, et cetera?
  • So it was in the Sibley building that we
  • started expanding our services with the case management,
  • and also with some testing.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Do you recall the year?
  • STANLEY BYRD: No, I don't.
  • I have to look at my resume to remember.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Late '90s?
  • STANLEY BYRD: It was late '90s, though.
  • So I mean, we're talking '96, so within three or four years
  • we had the grant.
  • So late '90s, yeah.
  • Because it was late '90s because--
  • I'm trying to think where our transition to work
  • was after that.
  • But it was definitely late '90s that we
  • were in the Sibley building.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And at that time, was
  • some of your goal being accomplished
  • of bringing the African-American community together?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Absolutely.
  • I mean, from the beginning, one of the first things
  • that Gary did, I think, in '97, I think one of the first things
  • was the annual picnic, which has always been well attended.
  • So that happened.
  • But the other thing was when we were in the Sibley building,
  • like, that's when we really started seeing
  • more of the population coming.
  • And at my tenure, when we had the Sibley building,
  • I created several programs.
  • One program was My Brother's Keeper.
  • And that was for individuals who were older.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: So that was after.
  • That wasn't before MOCHA was founded.
  • It was a part of MOCHA, My Brother's Keeper.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yeah.
  • I mean, that's what we named--
  • I mean, see, there was there was another organization called My
  • Brother's Keeper, but we used that word as an internal
  • program to meet the needs of thirty-five-year-old-plus
  • individuals.
  • Because one of the things that was happening is we were
  • getting a lot of young people at that point in time coming
  • to Sibley's.
  • We created something called Coffee Chat.
  • And initially, we were having those outreaches
  • in a couple of coffee houses, and then we
  • brought it into MOCHA.
  • I created a program called Safe Space.
  • And I facilitated discussions of spirituality.
  • Because one of the big things that certainly the young people
  • were presenting to us is I have no worth or value
  • because my church tells me so.
  • And so one of the challenges was to see
  • that there were still good.
  • And whatever Creator you believed in,
  • you were still good people.
  • And so the safe space--
  • sacred space.
  • Safe Space is the program I created here.
  • The Sacred Space Program was, really, monthly folks came in
  • and I just had them talk about spirituality.
  • And just to help them think about how they could reconnect
  • with their spiritual lives.
  • Because a lot of these young folks
  • were kicked out of their homes.
  • Many of them were homeless, you know, et cetera.
  • And so we were trying to help them reconnect.
  • So that's when we started expanding
  • those kind of social--
  • it wasn't just HIV and AIDS.
  • I mean, many of these people weren't positive.
  • But they came because it became sort of a community space
  • as well.
  • We also, when we were in the Sibley building,
  • we had a computer lab.
  • So folks could use the computer.
  • Some folks were looking for jobs, et cetera.
  • So they had the opportunity to be in a safe space
  • where they can do all those things.
  • So it became many things once we were in the Sibley building,
  • because it was our space.
  • You know?
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And you could create what you wanted.
  • Was there a youth group?
  • STANLEY BYRD: We worked with the GAGV
  • because we had many youth coming there.
  • And so initially we had someone coming from GAGV
  • to help us run--
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Patty Hayes.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yes.
  • Oh, you know these folks.
  • Wonderful.
  • Because we really wanted to make sure
  • that they were getting the benefit of someone who
  • had worked with youth groups.
  • And so Patty came in and helped run the youth groups.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And at that time, how many,
  • average number of youth, would come?
  • STANLEY BYRD: I would say twenty a day.
  • I mean, the place was always-- when we were open,
  • there was always the youth there.
  • And I think it became a safe haven,
  • I think, really, truly for some of the youth.
  • One of the things that we tried to do,
  • certainly, with some of the programming,
  • I certainly made sure with Sacred Space
  • and a couple of other programs, that we provided some food.
  • And it was usually sandwiches or pizza or something.
  • Sometimes this was the only meal that these kids had.
  • Sorry.
  • And so it became more than just a place for HIV and AIDS,
  • you know?
  • And one--
  • EVELYN BAILEY: It became a family.
  • STANLEY BYRD: It became a family.
  • And I don't know if you heard the name Fatima, Fatima Woods?
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Yes.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Fatima was our first transgender receptionist,
  • which she was very proud of, and we were proud of her.
  • And she, in some ways, became a mother
  • to some of the younger people.
  • And so, I mean, that was needed.
  • And I don't-- you know, just in that space, you know,
  • she could be motherly and talk to him about things that some
  • of us weren't as comfortable talking to.
  • Because the staff still was predominantly male at that
  • point in time.
  • And so it was great having other influences in the space.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And I suspect many of the youth,
  • or most of the youth, were male.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yeah, most of the youth were black.
  • We have some Hispanic.
  • One of the things that was interesting during that period
  • is there were, I would say, 50 percent
  • of the youth were individuals who
  • were looking at their identity as transgendered individuals.
  • So that was an interesting place too.
  • And who knows if the egg came first or the chicken.
  • Was it because of Fatima's presence
  • as a safe place for folks to come there,
  • or was it just a safe place?
  • And it really doesn't matter.
  • But it was amazing how many of the individuals
  • were assessing their identity as a transgendered individuals.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: It is amazing, because transgender
  • has really, over the past ten years,
  • come into such focus for the public,
  • and for the gay community.
  • I mean, because a person transgenders,
  • it does not imply that they're gay.
  • They may or may not be.
  • And there are a lot of, still, misconceptions about what
  • that whole experience is like.
  • There was a film that ImageOut showed on the 26th of March
  • on intersex.
  • And that's another area.
  • People who are open and who really
  • emanate a sense of care and concern,
  • always bring out and bring in young men and young women who
  • identify differently but know they
  • will be accepted, because the embrace is there.
  • It's not a wall.
  • It's not a hand going up saying, oh, step over here, let me--
  • it's come into my space and let's talk.
  • STANLEY BYRD: And we did eventually--
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And I think Fatima exemplified
  • that very, very well.
  • STANLEY BYRD: And we also had-- we did eventually
  • have young women coming up, some who identified
  • as lesbians, some not.
  • They came with their friends.
  • So that was pretty terrific as well,
  • you know, to bring other allies with them
  • as they were in our space.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And when did you move to Liberty Pole Way?
  • When did MOCHA go to--
  • STANLEY BYRD: Oh, goodness, when did they move there?
  • I mean, I was gone by then.
  • So they were still in this--
  • I left MOCHA in 2003, so they were still there in 2003.
  • So I can't really tell you when they moved,
  • but I know that they were still there in 2003.
  • So maybe within two years, maybe,
  • like, 2005, around that time.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Yes, because by the time
  • I came back to the Gay Alliance, which is 2003,
  • and had been on the board a few years,
  • you were then at Liberty Pole Way.
  • Because shortly after that, I was asked
  • to sit on the board of Mocha.
  • They wanted me because I am good at fundraising.
  • STANLEY BYRD: We still need you.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Yes.
  • And also because the Gay Alliance and MOCHA
  • wanted to create a closer bond, a more structured bond.
  • Today, you're back involved with MOCHA,
  • or are you just finishing your term?
  • STANLEY BYRD: Well, before we go there,
  • let me just go back to when we were in the Sibley building.
  • So we were talking about the youth.
  • And I love how you phrase, like, a warm, inviting
  • people really-- anyone can feel that and see that.
  • So often, I'm sitting in my office
  • and I have these young people coming in.
  • And they would sit in the chair while I was doing work.
  • And they would look at me, and they would say, are you gay?
  • I says, yes.
  • They said, well, you don't act gay.
  • And I would say, well, what does that look like?
  • Tell me what you think that is.
  • And they would sort of describe a lot of the stereotypes
  • that they had heard.
  • And they would say, why are you here?
  • I can't believe that you're here.
  • You could probably be doing other things.
  • And I said, well, you know, I helped
  • create this organization, and it's,
  • like, it's where I want to be right now
  • and I want to help people.
  • But it was just interesting.
  • I had three or four young people come in my office.
  • They thought I wasn't gay, you know?
  • It was interesting.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: I think that happens a great deal, and not
  • just with African-Americans.
  • The image that many people have of what gay is,
  • is really blown when they meet someone
  • who doesn't meet that image.
  • You have people in corporate America who, on the pansies
  • and on the image that people expect.
  • And that's what makes it so incredibly forceful.
  • It doesn't allow people to keep us in a box.
  • STANLEY BYRD: And I have to tell you, I actually run it.
  • I mean, I actually work for a couple other--
  • I work for Action Front Center as well.
  • I work there as well.
  • But one of the things that was interesting for me
  • with my experience in the way that I present
  • myself-- and I've always been this way,
  • this is just how I am.
  • There were some gay folks who said to me, why
  • are you ashamed of being gay?
  • And I says, I'm not ashamed of being gay.
  • What do you mean by that?
  • Once again, they were talking about my behaviors
  • and my way of presenting myself and talking to people.
  • And I would say, but I am gay and there is more than one way.
  • As many gay people there are, there
  • is that many ways of being gay.
  • But I actually had some individuals
  • who thought I was pretending or passing because of who I am.
  • And I had to tell them that no, this is how I do it.
  • (laughs) You know?
  • I'm sorry, I mean, you know, I'm here and I'm present
  • and I'm doing great work and I'm visible in the community.
  • And how I'm not ashamed.
  • I mean, I was on RATFA, Rochester Area Task
  • Force on AIDS.
  • I worked for Action Front Center as also their services
  • coordinator.
  • You know, I was very visible as a gay person,
  • as an advocate and champion for supporting people
  • with HIV and AIDS.
  • So it is very interesting that if you don't--
  • that stereotype that people have, if they don't see it.
  • One of the things that happens with stereotypes
  • is they can't trust you unless they can fit you
  • into that stereotype, right?
  • And so they didn't know what to do with me because I
  • wasn't like their stereotype.
  • So sometimes there was this distrust
  • because I didn't fit their little box.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And I think that's actually
  • the basis of a great deal of mistrust,
  • and also the basis of a great deal of trust.
  • Because when people realize you're no different than me,
  • you don't behave differently, you don't act differently,
  • you don't speak like a "gay person" quote,
  • unquote should speak, whatever that is, then
  • they have a very difficult time saying, get out of here,
  • and pushing you away.
  • STANLEY BYRD: And quite honestly, I
  • mean, here at the University of Rochester, and certainly
  • things--
  • something like this is going to make
  • me more visible than I was.
  • But there's hundreds of people who know I'm gay here.
  • I told my boss in my first one-on-one meeting
  • with him that I was gay.
  • He thought that was a wonderful addition
  • to the diversity of the University
  • is how he phrased it.
  • And that was the end of that conversation.
  • There's never been another conversation around it.
  • So I certainly choose--
  • I out myself a lot because I do a lot of workshops.
  • And I think it's important when there's not a gay person
  • present that there's at least a voice there.
  • So it's just so interesting.
  • And so one of the most challenges
  • I've had sometimes with black African-American folks,
  • particularly folks who are more religious than others.
  • And those are the folks I sometimes--
  • I call it go after them, meaning I sit
  • and I present myself fully as who I am.
  • And they can't put me in a box either.
  • And so I've had some of those folks
  • say are you sure you're OK?
  • Yes, it's not about the stereotypes.
  • And I think once--
  • like you said, once individuals start seeing people
  • as individuals, once more and more people--
  • and that's what's happening in this country--
  • know people, friends, their children, their loved ones who
  • are gay, and I'm using gay to include that whole continuum,
  • it's like some of the stuff falls away, which is wonderful
  • that it does fall away.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: But there are still
  • pockets in this country where segregation
  • and not allowing African-Americans
  • into an establishment still exists.
  • I find it mind-blowing to think about that and to realize that.
  • I want to ask you a little bit more about the issue of faith,
  • spirituality, and being gay.
  • One of the most difficult hurdles
  • to overcome in this community is the strong presence
  • of the black churches that seem to be unbending
  • in their unwillingness to even acknowledge
  • parishioners being gay.
  • You must know Richard Sarkis.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yes.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Richard Sarkis sat on
  • or was a part of the church group that met, I think,
  • once a month of African-American ministers and pastors.
  • STANLEY BYRD: There was the Black Leadership Commission
  • on AIDS, that's what--
  • BLCA.
  • Yes, I was on that.
  • I was part of that, too.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: And he went to that meeting at one point
  • and asked for some kind of support,
  • financial perhaps, but more likely to be
  • able to put into their churches information, and got a flat no.
  • How is it possible for African-American churches
  • in this city to reject the young people, the middle-aged people,
  • the seniors who are gay but who are also
  • members of the congregation and are still
  • closeted because they're unwilling to put themselves out
  • there and be ostracized.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Yeah, you've just said it.
  • I mean, one of the things about that
  • is many of the leaders of some of these churches have no idea
  • that they may have fifty or sixty
  • people in their congregation who are
  • LGBT because of the fear of being ostracized
  • from the church.
  • And for many, many African-Americans
  • who grew up in the church, the church
  • was the center of community, the church was the center of life.
  • And so some people push their full identities back
  • because they still want that experience, even though for me
  • it's not fully that experience because you're not
  • being fully who you are in the midst of all that.
  • So yeah, I don't--
  • it's a challenging thing for me to fathom
  • when I think that many of the churches
  • are based on the life of Jesus Christ and what he lived
  • and what he preached and how he lived his life.
  • And so that's really challenging sometimes
  • as opposed to folks going back to Leviticus
  • and using one line out of sixty lines
  • that speaks to what's not clean and unclean or proper or not
  • proper.
  • So it's very challenging to me as a very spiritual person.
  • I'm also a non-denominational interfaith minister.
  • So that's very challenging to me in my own spiritual beliefs.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: My background is Roman Catholicism.
  • But I'm more liberated than--
  • it seems to me that it's easier for African-American churches
  • to come together with many different faiths and worship
  • and have an ecumenical service of prayer
  • than it is for them to talk about their identity.
  • And that's not a criticism or a negative thing.
  • That's true in my own faith as well.
  • I mean, my own family as well.
  • But--
  • STANLEY BYRD: Well, I only can speak to it personally,
  • and this is how I can speak to it personally.
  • When I even think about individuals
  • who push their family members away because
  • of their sexual orientation, I think one of the challenges
  • is that we still live in this very racist, oppressive, sexist
  • country.
  • I'm only going to talk about the US
  • because I don't know any other countries.
  • And I know that for me and when I have interacted
  • with my relatives, who I'm lucky that my immediate family
  • and my brothers and et cetera are--
  • I'm not going to say the word supportive.
  • They love me for who I am period,
  • and that has never changed.
  • But when I think about this, when
  • we look at the intersectionality of race,
  • because of the racism and the depth of that in this country,
  • to add one more layer of oppression is too painful.
  • It's too painful.
  • So until we can get people to even look at that piece,
  • the church is not going to change,
  • individual families aren't going to change.
  • But it's so painful to add another layer
  • and be identified as a black, gay person, whatever.
  • Adding that extra layer to experience even more oppression
  • and discrimination, ostracization?
  • I mean, I think that's too painful for people.
  • And so I think that's why--
  • the church can't look at this issue.
  • Individuals have to look at this issue in their own faith
  • environment, OK?
  • And we have to look at the intersectionality of race,
  • sexual orientation, and gender.
  • We have to look at all of those all at
  • once because they are all interconnected.
  • I mean, if you think about it, if the stereotype of gay men
  • was that they were not effeminate, well,
  • that's sexism too.
  • It's not just homophobia.
  • It's sexism as well.
  • That there's something wrong with being effeminate or being
  • feminine or being female.
  • So it's just that individuals can look at this.
  • Institutions can't.
  • Individuals have to make the difference.
  • And it's not until the individuals
  • start making those inroads will these things change.
  • I mean, and so I think we're going to stay stuck
  • with that for years to come.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: I agree with you.
  • Stan, when you look back over your life,
  • over the work you've done, what are you most proud of?
  • STANLEY BYRD: And just any work or just--
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Any work.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Well, that's interesting.
  • That actually goes back a long time ago.
  • For my first twenty years, I worked with children
  • with disabilities.
  • I ran group homes for children with disabilities.
  • I was one of the first to open what's
  • called an intermediate care facility in Penfield in 1979.
  • I opened up a group home for eight children
  • with serious disabilities.
  • These were children who couldn't walk, couldn't talk.
  • So we became their arms and legs, et cetera.
  • And I'm proud of being able to create family for them.
  • Some of them had family, but the staff that I had, we loved--
  • they were our children.
  • We took them any place any other children would go to.
  • I even took some children to Disney World,
  • or Disneyland-- is it land or world in Florida?
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Land.
  • STANLEY BYRD: I always get it confused.
  • So I have to say, when I look back
  • on my whole career, that's work that's
  • still love work of my heart.
  • Because to do something that has such value to it at a time
  • when it was people were just being de-institutionalized
  • from those horrible places.
  • And I was one of those people who was at the front of that.
  • So that's one of the things I'm most
  • proud of is that experience.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: If you had the opportunity
  • to address a group of young males,
  • females, African-American, Hispanic, Caucasian, Asian,
  • about being gay, what would you say to them?
  • STANLEY BYRD: I actually had that opportunity last winter.
  • The School of Medicine and Dentistry offers symposiums,
  • and I was asked to come in to talk about my experience
  • as a gay person.
  • And this was to certainly residents, medical students.
  • And it was a mixed group, a very mixed group, actually.
  • And so I got to talk about my experience.
  • And at first it was a little nerve--
  • I was a little nervous, but I realized
  • they all came because they knew what the topic was,
  • so it was at least an audience that was interested in hearing
  • what I had to say.
  • One of the things I talked about were
  • similar to the things I talked about with you today.
  • I talked about this sense of spirituality
  • that we still have, that we haven't lost that because
  • of our sexual orientation.
  • And if we don't have it, we're always looking for it.
  • There's many of us still looking for that place
  • to go to be comfortable.
  • I talk about the intersectionality
  • of race and gender and sexual orientation,
  • and how sometimes I'm asked to join either a black group
  • or a gay group.
  • And I'm a black man who is gay, and I can't separate that out.
  • Those are two core pieces of my identity.
  • And that when I'm asked to choose,
  • it's a very, very challenging task for me to choose.
  • Because wherever I go, I want to take all of me.
  • And so when I'm choosing like that, there's a part of me
  • that I feel like sometimes gets left behind.
  • So I talked about that.
  • And I talked about my experiences,
  • in addition to Action Front Center, MOCHA, ARI,
  • I also was the director of the person who helped bring
  • Unity Fellowship Church here.
  • It used to be called Tawopana Unity Fellowship,
  • but now it's Unity Fellowship Church.
  • I was the organizer.
  • I was the organizing person for the committee
  • that brought that church here.
  • Because that church was formed in 1985, or at least that--
  • what do I want to call it?
  • Well, that church was formed in 1985 in California
  • specifically for African-American Latinos and et
  • cetera who were gay, lesbian, bisexual,
  • transgender, to have an experience,
  • the full black church experience,
  • in a place that was welcoming and affirming.
  • And then for the first two years of that church being here,
  • I was the board chair for that church.
  • So I talk about that and my own spirituality.
  • Dean Brenda Lee, who is here at the University, who brought me
  • in to speak, one of the things I said to her that she didn't
  • know is that I'm not a denomination of faith minister.
  • I don't have a church right now, but I still
  • do weddings and baby blessings and union ceremonies and all
  • those things.
  • People are kind of surprised to hear that part of it, too.
  • And I even said to her with all these students around,
  • I said, so, by the way, how did you know I was gay?
  • Because we never talked about it.
  • But people know and people share it.
  • But it's a situation where I still get great respect
  • from African-Americans.
  • I get great respect from my other colleagues, et cetera.
  • It's not-- it hasn't presented as a concern.
  • So I talk about that, and I talk about my own journey.
  • Because when I talk to young people,
  • particularly, I didn't succeed here
  • at the University of Rochester.
  • It was such an unwelcoming environment for me
  • at that time, that '72 to '74.
  • And then the whole sexual orientation piece
  • coming up, and then feeling the racism here,
  • I did not succeed here.
  • I mean, I left because I didn't succeed.
  • What I said to the group, I ended my life here
  • in May of 1974.
  • By September of 1974, I was already in school again.
  • I was in Massachusetts.
  • That's when I went to Boston.
  • So I never stopped going to school.
  • And I came back to Rochester after a year,
  • got into St. John Fisher as an interim, and then got into--
  • so it took me seven years to get my Bachelor's, OK?
  • And I say that there's no shame in that for me.
  • I never stop on that journey.
  • I never stopped.
  • There was not a semester that I did not go to school.
  • And I worked full time throughout all of this.
  • I've never had that experience of just--
  • so I talked to them about that and how
  • for those of you who might be struggling or challenging
  • about, well, am I meeting this in the timeline
  • that everyone else is, to let that go.
  • As long as you're still following your passion,
  • you're following that journey that you set out for yourself,
  • or the goals, et cetera, you're still on the path.
  • And so I shared things like that.
  • And I share things like that--
  • I've done that for--
  • there's a group on campus.
  • It's all students, undergrad students,
  • and I shared that story with them as well.
  • So I get the opportunity to kind of share information like that.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: That is quite a story.
  • One more question.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Sure.
  • And you forgot you had a question about MOCHA today,
  • so I don't want you to forget that one.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Well, it's part of this question, actually.
  • What are the challenges today that
  • face MOCHA, the gay, African-American community,
  • that will be the next step to being who you
  • are, where you are, whenever?
  • STANLEY BYRD: I'll check the financial side first
  • because that's the biggest threat.
  • The biggest threat right now is that we're predominately grant
  • funded, and grants are--
  • right now grants are being cut.
  • And the model of service delivery is changing,
  • so we really need to look at changing our model of service
  • delivery, and create ways of fundraising so that we
  • can make sure that we have some funds that are not
  • so restricted.
  • So that's a real, true challenge.
  • And some of the changes in the state
  • budget and the federal budget related to social services.
  • We're definitely going to feel that soon, and some money.
  • So the money change is a real challenge.
  • And so then the other piece is the programming.
  • And the programming is, what model do we look at?
  • Is it a model that includes some closer relationship
  • with a clinic?
  • Is it a model that includes some--
  • sort of going back to the past a little
  • bit-- some home health-care kinds of things still,
  • so people can still live in their homes?
  • And so we're looking at what those models may look like.
  • We're doing that research now as we're
  • working on our strategic plan.
  • So I would say funding, but who do we want to be,
  • and how do we roll with the times
  • to make sure that we're still meeting
  • the needs of the population?
  • As the disease itself becomes more of a chronic disease,
  • we're looking more at holistic health and wellness.
  • So that's one of the things we're looking at, too,
  • is how to become an agency that's
  • looking at holistic health and wellness
  • for the African and Latino community. (coughs)
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Do you need water?
  • STANLEY BYRD: It's just the dryness in here.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: The dryness in here, yes.
  • STANLEY BYRD: So I've been on the board for two years now.
  • I was the interim president from December to March
  • and we just elected a new president.
  • I'm going to remain on the board because I want
  • to be able to continue to--
  • I'm on the strategic planning committee,
  • I'm on the board development committee.
  • So I want to continue developing the board
  • so we have the best people on the board.
  • And I'm also on the--
  • I'm not on the fundraising committee,
  • but I think it's really just those two.
  • So I will continue to stay on the board
  • and work behind the scenes in those committees.
  • There are also lots of things we need
  • to do around human resources and policies and procedures
  • that if I'm not the president or the vice president--
  • I was the vice president for two years,
  • I can put my attention on now, to really kind of make sure
  • the infrastructure is solid and strong,
  • so that's where I would like to be spending my time
  • for the next year or two.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Well, I want to thank you for your time.
  • And if I were to hallmark your life,
  • it would be creating family where family does not exist.
  • Because you've done it for children with disabilities.
  • You've done it for your own community.
  • You've done it for the greater Rochester community
  • in creating the strength that comes
  • from the bonds of being a part of a group,
  • being part of a family.
  • STANLEY BYRD: Thank you.
  • I mean, I can see that, and I never
  • thought about it that way.
  • But it has been my passion to really make a difference.
  • And a lot of that has meant bringing people together
  • in a way that they're supportive to each other, whatever
  • that means.
  • So wow, yeah I like that.
  • Thank you for that.
  • EVELYN BAILEY: Well, thank you, Stan.
  • It's been a pleasure.