Green Thursday, radio program, October 25, 1973
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: So could we go through that a little bit?
- ELIZABETH BELL: And what is your opinion, Geryllaeyn?
- (laughter)
- ELIZABETH BELL: Start from the top.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: Well, I don't know.
- My opinion-- I feel two completely different ways
- about it.
- One, I feel that women should be talking directly
- to women and not to men, and that if men
- want to know about lesbianism they should go read a book,
- or call a public library, or--
- you know, just totally divorce women talking to men.
- Because sometimes, I get the distinct impression
- in speaking engagements that the men don't really
- care except for the fact that they're threatened,
- and that they care about very much.
- So it's not lesbianism or a lifestyle
- of being a woman loving another woman that they're
- concerned with at all.
- It's the lifestyle of a woman being able to cope very, very
- well without a man.
- That's what they're worried about.
- So on my left hand, no, women should not talk to men at all.
- You know, close your eyes when you pass them
- in the street, (unintelligible).
- On the other hand, I think it's very, very important
- for women to talk to men, because I
- think that there are those one out of five, or two
- out of five, or whatever, men who are very, very sincerely
- wanting to know what's going on, not so much so
- that they can say, "Aha!
- Now I understand what being a dyke is all about."
- Because they never will.
- Because they can never be a dyke, right?
- Well, I guess they could.
- We had Peggy on the show a few weeks ago, and she was trying.
- But not so much knowing what it's like for identification,
- but just simply knowing, because dykes are reality,
- and they're people.
- And it's maybe a whole manner of thinking or lifestyle
- that they haven't thought about yet.
- And they really do want to know.
- They want to understand human emotion.
- So there I am with two--
- a complete dichotomy.
- ELIZABETH BELL: I think I sort of--
- I find in myself the same dichotomy,
- for a little bit different reasons, per usual.
- (laughter)
- I find-- I find the two different things--
- going to talk to a group of women
- and going to talk to a mixed group--
- are just two completely different experiences.
- I find more happens.
- Questions go further than just who
- are you, and what have you done, and what did you do,
- and what are you all about.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: And did you like it?
- ELIZABETH BELL: And did you like it?
- When it's a whole group of women, defenses are down, or--
- I don't know.
- It's just-- it's just a lot easier, a lot softer,
- a lot smoother.
- And when it's a group of men, I guess
- everybody's a little bit threatened, because nobody
- really understands where everybody
- is standing type of thing.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: Right.
- And also, possibly, that if there are men in the audience
- the women in the audience feel that they cannot be completely
- honest with themselves in the sense that they are being
- watched-- intimidated.
- ELIZABETH BELL: I'm not even sure if they feel they cannot
- be honest.
- They maybe just don't even get to that point.
- Because they always seem to get to a shallower level.
- And when you have women in the audience, people
- all of a sudden can cope with just the question of,
- am I going to be honest, am I going to be--
- to hide it from me.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: Well, do you feel that women
- are intimidated by men?
- Do you feel that it's an active threat?
- Or do you think it's more that--
- a completely socialized thing--
- that people-- that it's more of a passive threat, I guess,
- is the only way to put it?
- ELIZABETH BELL: I think it's more of a passive threat,
- fall into a role type thing.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: And then you
- just don't bother to get out of the role?
- ELIZABETH BELL: Well, an active threat
- you have to think twice about.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: That's true.
- ELIZABETH BELL: And when the threat is real,
- it takes a lot more time to think twice about it,
- if you know-- if you follow.
- And so I think just the logistics
- tend to make it passive.
- Maybe it turns into an active threat.
- And maybe, eventually, you start getting angry.
- Or eventually, you start hearing things
- that you never heard before.
- But I think, in the beginning, it's pretty passive.
- And something like a speaking engagement
- is pretty novel to most people.
- I think it begins as just a curiosity, sort
- of poking the finger.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: Yes.
- ELIZABETH BELL: If that made any sense.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: Right.
- Well, to sum that all up is Melanie with Good Guys.
- And before that, I have to sneak in one small announcement.
- This is Green Thursday, and this is WCMF in Rochester, New York.
- (music plays)
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: A threatened cut-off
- of funds for Los Angeles' Gay Community Services Center
- by the US Department of Health, Education, and Welfare
- was prevented recently when nineteen California
- members of Congress responded favorably to a GCSC appeal.
- The Gay Community Services Center
- is participating in the Drug Abuse Training
- Program funded by the HEW through the National Free
- Clinic Council.
- The $20,000 grant for staff training
- was used to initiate what the Center believes
- is the nation's first drug abuse training program specifically
- for gays.
- It has also managed to open a recovery house
- for short-term in-residence treatment of gays
- with drug abuse problems, primarily alcoholism.
- The program and the federal grant
- were mentioned in an article in The Los Angeles Times, which
- came to the attention of Caspar W. Weinberger, Health,
- Education, and Welfare Secretary.
- Shortly thereafter, Weinberger began the development
- of a new HEW policy which would have excluded the Gay Community
- Services Center and all other gay-oriented social service
- facilities from federal funding.
- However, Morris Kight, the Board President of the Gay Community
- Services Center, was made aware of Mr. Weinberger's plans
- and promptly appealed to California Congressmen for aid.
- Of those who wrote to Weinberger directly,
- Representative Phillip Burton of San Francisco
- was one of the most emphatic in opposing fund cut-offs.
- He told Weinberger in a letter that GCSC's programs
- were addressing human needs, and cutting off funds
- for them would be a rank injustice and a grave mistake.
- Bob Heard, the Head of the National Free Clinic Council
- of San Francisco, says that many member clinics
- were so incensed at the threatened cut-off in funding
- for the gay community services center
- that they would refuse further federal funding if GCSC
- were discriminated against.
- Shortly thereafter, some nineteen California Congressmen
- came to the Gay Community Service Center's support.
- And the Department of Health, Education, and Welfare
- agreed to continue financial support to GCSC, as well
- as other gay service centers.
- Advocate 123.
- PAM BARRALE: Haven fallen short of her ten thousand vote target
- in Detroit, Michigan's primary election,
- lesbian Common Council candidate Connie--
- I'm sorry, I can't pronounce this word.
- What's her name?
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: McConnohie
- PAM BARRALE: That's right.
- McConnohie blamed apathy in the gay community for her defeat.
- She also said that the radical faction of the gay community,
- through the Gay Liberator newspaper,
- was instrumental in dividing her strength by backing
- a socialist workers party candidate.
- McConnohie, who asked Detroit voters to "elect a real man"
- in a half-serious, half-camp campaign
- finished ninety-second in a field of one hundred
- and fourteen candidates.
- Her twenty seven--two thousand seven hundred vote total was
- about twenty thousand short of what it took to enter
- the general election field of eighteen candidates.
- "Looking for bright spots," she said,
- "a lot of people, a lot of good people, including Straights,
- worked hard for me."
- She added that she was also pleased
- by the objective coverage of her candidacy
- by The Detroit News, a major Detroit journal.
- McConnohie, who for months had been
- in the middle of a fight between two factions
- in the gay community--
- those people who were in her support, and those who agreed
- with the Gay Liberator, which in one issue
- turned her "Back Mac" slogan into a "Sack Mac" banner
- headline.
- The only harmony between the two groups
- was their mutual support of a proposed city charter, which
- calls for the creation of an eleven-member human rights
- commission empowered to act against discrimination
- on the basis of sexual orientation,
- among other things.
- Advocate 123.
- ELIZABETH BELL: Though suspended by his school board
- without pay, Paramus, New Jersey teacher, John Gish,
- has gained what may be the most dramatic editorial
- support in the history of gay liberation.
- The thirty-six-year-old gay activist suspended on the same
- day he thought he had won his symbolic fight to use
- the student lunchroom from which he had been barred,
- has also gained renewed financial backing from
- the powerful National Education Association in its state
- and local arms.
- The resounding editorial defense in the September twenty-fourth
- Hackensack Record contended that the Paramus Board of Education
- had failed to prove that a gay teacher has
- a negative influence on students.
- The editorial headline quote, "A Sorry Humiliating Business,"
- unquote, called Gish's suspension and other board
- activities against him the sort of experience
- that human beings, particularly those concerned
- with educating the young, should not have to go through.
- It went on to ask whether a school administration has
- any right to deal in this manner with an alleged homosexual who
- openly advocates civil rights for other homosexuals.
- We submit the board has no such right.
- They called his suspension unconscionable
- and demanded that the board rescind its action.
- Gish, meantime, was notified that his monthly salary will
- be paid by the Academic Freedom Fund of the National Education
- Association for at least the next four months.
- (music plays)
- PAM BARRALE: Those were two songs
- by Mary Travers, Children One and All and The First Time
- Ever I Saw Your Face.
- And that second cut was dedicated to someone.
- Elizabeth is going to do a dedication for us.
- ELIZABETH BELL: It was to you, Marja, Marja.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: Well.
- (laughter)
- PAM BARRALE: There's going to be another dance
- this Saturday, the twenty-seventh,
- starting at nine o'clock.
- It's being sponsored by Gay Liberation
- Front on the University of Rochester River campus.
- It's being held in the Danforth Dining Center.
- And we're unsure of the donation.
- We think it's fifty cents for students
- and one dollar for anyone else, but we're not really sure.
- So don't quote us on that.
- But that is a dance, nine o'clock,
- the Danforth Dining Center in the University
- of Rochester River campus.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: And also this weekend the twenty-seventh
- and twenty-eighth, the NYSCO--
- there's supposed to be a G in there--
- Conference is being held this weekend.
- It's the New York State Coalition of Gay Organizations.
- It's being hosted by the Gay Alliance of the Genesee Valley,
- and it will be held on Saturday at the Universalist
- Church, which is at 150 Clinton Avenue South.
- Registration for the conference will
- be Friday evening from seven thirty until one o'clock.
- That's this Friday evening.
- Saturday at twelve thirty is a business meeting.
- And at two o'clock and three thirty
- are workshops, which will be determined at the business
- meeting.
- Six thirty, there is a potluck supper
- for women, or for everyone--
- I'm not sure which, but I think you better find out--
- I better find out--
- which will be held at the Gay Alliance Center
- at 812 Brown Street.
- And then on Sunday, once again, will be a twelve thirty
- business meeting.
- And it is possible to call GAGV for further information.
- And since I've completely botched this up,
- it might be a very good idea to do that.
- The number is 436-7670, 436-7670.
- Tell them you want to know about the NYSCGO conference
- because Geryllaeyn made absolutely no sense.
- PAM BARRALE: The last two songs we'll hear tonight
- are Friends by Bette Midler and All I Want by Joni Mitchell.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: And, once again, we
- are Geryllaeyn Naundorf and--
- PAM BARRALE: Pam Barrale--
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: And this is--
- PAM BARRALE: --and--
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: --oh, yes.
- And this is--
- ELIZABETH BELL: Liz Bell.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: Liz Bell.
- And we're on Green Thursday.
- We'll be back in two weeks.
- And Bruce Jewell will be here to do his section of the show
- next week.
- Until then--
- ELIZABETH BELL: I would like to make two words more
- than I was allotted.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: Oh, OK.
- PAM BARRALE: Two.
- ELIZABETH BELL: I would like to say
- that although Halloween comes but once a year,
- that costuming is a daily event.
- And I would like to wish everybody a happy Halloween
- and a wonderful costuming.
- GERYLLAEYN NAUNDORF: And have a beautiful Green Thursday.
- ELIZABETH BELL: Yes.
- (music plays)